Author Topic: Sales figures of Congolese albums according SNEP  (Read 778 times)

CM PRINCE #15 on: September 18, 2019, 20:20

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Aint « bord ezanga kombo » certified gold in france ? (50k cds sold)

I remember going to a shop in Paris one week after the release of BEK. With the guy selling B.E.K. saying to people that he had two versions. The cheap one (being piracy version made by himself) being the half of the price and the original one (having the booklet) and the most people ending up by buying the cheap one. The same for the first volume of BEK-videoclips.
I can confirm this is 1000% true

SLK97 #16 on: September 18, 2019, 20:29

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I think that its time for Congolese bandleaders to get united to stand up for their rights in DR Congo. That all those radiostations, tv-channels, nigthclubs, restaurants in Kinshasa, Kongo Central, Kivu, Katanga, Kasai, Province Oriental and Bandundu have to pay taxes , that the governement comes with a law that protect artists against piracy and that they arrest all those Chinese, Indian and Libanese people who doing it (selling albums everywhere for $1). If that happens they have just to sell 1 million copies (Congo has more than 83 millions inhabitants) to become multi-millionaires. They have not be forced to make 30 songs, live on matolo and mabanga, having to do black business or touring months long in Europe to survive. Also it will allow artists living in Kisangani, Lubumbashi, Goma, Bukavu, Kananga and Matadi to live well without being known in Kinshasa. If this all don't happen then they will have a big problem in the future. Imagine if the concert-ban stays until 2030 or that World War III comes in Europe, bako suka wapi? They have to fix those problem and stop those stupid wars.

I wish this could happen, but the problem is that some of our bandleaders are too stubborn to co-operate with one another, let alone as a collective. Or whenever one suggests something that involves them coming together, there's always someone who's not satisfied with the terms thus resulting in the idea falling through.

Paysan Congolais #17 on: September 18, 2019, 20:39

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Very misleading.

Those are the numbers for legal sales in France.

Globally, if you take legal and illegal sales into account, those albums sold hundreds of thousands, even millions.

Generally, this obsession with sales in France is very stupid.
Until we as Congolese will think as colonized peoe it will be like that. Until we gonna give our babies French names instead of Congolese ones and until we will value a person on how much good french he speaks nothing will change. Even this whole Bercy obsession of artists and France obsession with Congolese artists it is very stupid and colonized mind like

Its doesn't have something to do with having a colonized mind. Those stuff about album sales in Dr Congo doesn't exist anymore since the big crisis made by the MPR-regime, so they switched it to Europe where there is a big community since the mid '90s. Back in the 60s and 70s Congolese artists used often to brag about the sales they made in DR Congo, artists like Lutumba Simaro and Evoloko Lay receiving gold records from Soneca. Since 1991 they don't have those cd/disc facotries in Kinshasa, also those discs they sold are in reality piracy cds, because they pay zero tax to Socoda/Soneca and the governement. So those albums sales don't count and the artists don't really make alot of money from the albums they sell in Kinshasa, most albums don't even arrive in other cities (except those made by Libanese, Chinese and Indian pople) .They also talk often about the album sales they made in France, because Congolese artists used to brag/lie about having received a gold record in France which wasn't true with other artists also wanted to do the same thing and falling in the same trap. Starting then also to lie to the public and creating confusion by saying that they received a gold record because of the albums they sold around the world while every country has his own music recording certification (SABAM for Belgium, Sacem/Snep for France, IRAA for USA, etc.). The French media exposed Papa Wemba with that when he got arrested, mocking him that he only sold 6.000 copies for Bakala Dia Kuba in France while it was a big succes in the Congolese community of France. Zacharie Bababaswe made back in 2003 a whole article about those albums sales and in 1999 released a VHS on the market where he visited with King Kester Emeneya SACEM to look if there was a Congolese artist who received a gold record in France.



Also you don't have mythic musichalls in Kinshasa. We had the famous Cine Palladium where Papa Wemba, Tabu Ley, Franco Luambo Makiadi and Abeti Masikini gave memorable shows, but it got abandoned in the 80s. They tried to renovate it in 1996, changing the name into Cinemax, but the governement sold it to Libanese businessmen in 2004 who broke it down. The obession with Bercy started after that Koffi Olomide there. Before 1999 nobody outside France knew even the existence of Bercy. It started to get know when Koffi started to promote his show after just having released Droit de Veto on the market.

It was not that they wanted to look like white people, it was that they saw it as victory for the African diaspora living in Europe for having filled the biggest musichall of Paris without being native inhabitants and feeling themselves not respected. But it went quickly wrong because other Congolese artists wanted then to prove that they were more popular then the other one by having a bigger crowd at Bercy and those who performed before them trying to sabote those shows (the Congolese mentality, not wanted to accept other succes). The same thing happened in Congo itself with Stade des Martyrs.

It has a little bit to do with a colonized mind. I partly blame Kester when he started that campaign about congolese music being "in the ghetto", which was and, still is, stupid since congolese music is one of the most played music in the world. But the big issue a lot of these people have is that congolese music is not played in the West. It fueled the congolese obsession withe the so-called "world music", which is detrimental to the genre. That's why you have a lot of people making stupid comparisons between congolese musicians and musicians like Gims or American musicians.

The idea of trying to assess the success of congolese musicians by using numbers they make in France is a weird one. The Congolese diaspora back then was not that numerous. When those albums were out you only had around 100.000 congolese people in France, even less.  Congolese musicians created all those fake disque d'or stories because they wanted recognition for the real success they were having in Africa but which was not took into account.

I think we should move forward and leave that in the past. Record sales are dying everywhere anyway. 

But I think you are right when it comes to those mythic music halls.

Paysan Congolais #18 on: September 18, 2019, 20:46

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Very misleading.

Those are the numbers for legal sales in France.

Globally, if you take legal and illegal sales into account, those albums sold hundreds of thousands, even millions.

Generally, this obsession with sales in France is very stupid.
Until we as Congolese will think as colonized peoe it will be like that. Until we gonna give our babies French names instead of Congolese ones and until we will value a person on how much good french he speaks nothing will change. Even this whole Bercy obsession of artists and France obsession with Congolese artists it is very stupid and colonized mind like

Congolese people like to underestimate our own artists and our own genre. Now, you'll see a bunch of stupid people uses these numbers to try to humiliate our musicians by comparing it to the numbers of Gims or Daju in France.

archos #19 on: September 18, 2019, 22:09

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Very misleading.

Those are the numbers for legal sales in France.

Globally, if you take legal and illegal sales into account, those albums sold hundreds of thousands, even millions.

Generally, this obsession with sales in France is very stupid.
Until we as Congolese will think as colonized peoe it will be like that. Until we gonna give our babies French names instead of Congolese ones and until we will value a person on how much good french he speaks nothing will change. Even this whole Bercy obsession of artists and France obsession with Congolese artists it is very stupid and colonized mind like

Congolese people like to underestimate our own artists and our own genre. Now, you'll see a bunch of stupid people uses these numbers to try to humiliate our musicians by comparing it to the numbers of Gims or Daju in France.

 or the one who seems to have better sales to the rest,i wont say no name ohhhh

congo-243 #20 on: September 18, 2019, 22:29

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Very misleading.

Those are the numbers for legal sales in France.

Globally, if you take legal and illegal sales into account, those albums sold hundreds of thousands, even millions.

Generally, this obsession with sales in France is very stupid.
Until we as Congolese will think as colonized peoe it will be like that. Until we gonna give our babies French names instead of Congolese ones and until we will value a person on how much good french he speaks nothing will change. Even this whole Bercy obsession of artists and France obsession with Congolese artists it is very stupid and colonized mind like

Congolese people like to underestimate our own artists and our own genre. Now, you'll see a bunch of stupid people uses these numbers to try to humiliate our musicians by comparing it to the numbers of Gims or Daju in France.

 or the one who seems to have better sales to the rest,i wont say no name ohhhh
Spill the beans

Bohemian Rhapsody #21 on: September 19, 2019, 07:16

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Very misleading.

Those are the numbers for legal sales in France.

Globally, if you take legal and illegal sales into account, those albums sold hundreds of thousands, even millions.

Generally, this obsession with sales in France is very stupid.
Until we as Congolese will think as colonized peoe it will be like that. Until we gonna give our babies French names instead of Congolese ones and until we will value a person on how much good french he speaks nothing will change. Even this whole Bercy obsession of artists and France obsession with Congolese artists it is very stupid and colonized mind like

Its doesn't have something to do with having a colonized mind. Those stuff about album sales in Dr Congo doesn't exist anymore since the big crisis made by the MPR-regime, so they switched it to Europe where there is a big community since the mid '90s. Back in the 60s and 70s Congolese artists used often to brag about the sales they made in DR Congo, artists like Lutumba Simaro and Evoloko Lay receiving gold records from Soneca. Since 1991 they don't have those cd/disc facotries in Kinshasa, also those discs they sold are in reality piracy cds, because they pay zero tax to Socoda/Soneca and the governement. So those albums sales don't count and the artists don't really make alot of money from the albums they sell in Kinshasa, most albums don't even arrive in other cities (except those made by Libanese, Chinese and Indian pople) .They also talk often about the album sales they made in France, because Congolese artists used to brag/lie about having received a gold record in France which wasn't true with other artists also wanted to do the same thing and falling in the same trap. Starting then also to lie to the public and creating confusion by saying that they received a gold record because of the albums they sold around the world while every country has his own music recording certification (SABAM for Belgium, Sacem/Snep for France, IRAA for USA, etc.). The French media exposed Papa Wemba with that when he got arrested, mocking him that he only sold 6.000 copies for Bakala Dia Kuba in France while it was a big succes in the Congolese community of France. Zacharie Bababaswe made back in 2003 a whole article about those albums sales and in 1999 released a VHS on the market where he visited with King Kester Emeneya SACEM to look if there was a Congolese artist who received a gold record in France.



Also you don't have mythic musichalls in Kinshasa. We had the famous Cine Palladium where Papa Wemba, Tabu Ley, Franco Luambo Makiadi and Abeti Masikini gave memorable shows, but it got abandoned in the 80s. They tried to renovate it in 1996, changing the name into Cinemax, but the governement sold it to Libanese businessmen in 2004 who broke it down. The obession with Bercy started after that Koffi Olomide there. Before 1999 nobody outside France knew even the existence of Bercy. It started to get know when Koffi started to promote his show after just having released Droit de Veto on the market.

It was not that they wanted to look like white people, it was that they saw it as victory for the African diaspora living in Europe for having filled the biggest musichall of Paris without being native inhabitants and feeling themselves not respected. But it went quickly wrong because other Congolese artists wanted then to prove that they were more popular then the other one by having a bigger crowd at Bercy and those who performed before them trying to sabote those shows (the Congolese mentality, not wanted to accept other succes). The same thing happened in Congo itself with Stade des Martyrs.

Touring. Touring increase mere exposure to more people greater than the sample size than they're used too. Artists should think strategically.

The Afro Diaspora is very grande at best. The Caribbean and Latin America (Colombia, Brazil, etc) has a big population of Afro descent people. This is why folks like Mbilia Bel, Tabu Ley, Pepe Kalle, Aurlus Mabele, Kanda Bongo, etc took advantage. If artists toured there instead of choosing just Europe, more streams and revenue would be generated.




Jdog #22 on: September 21, 2019, 22:56

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Im shocked that some of those numbers are as low as they are, maybe they really did sell them on the black market and piracy really does come into effect. These days people stream music more then they actually buy songs/albums.
Or moto asala le monde eza yo Nzambe tata, Kita okata po mokili trop matata, kata- Fally Ipupa

Jdog #23 on: September 21, 2019, 23:07

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yeah sounds quite strange,but the good thing for me it goes to show how sales and views can mean nothing,all those album were listened to by millions of people around the world
Yes they were listened to by millions of people around the world but how much they actually make off of actual music?

I think that its time for Congolese bandleaders to get united to stand up for their rights in DR Congo. That all those radiostations, tv-channels, nigthclubs, restaurants in Kinshasa, Kongo Central, Kivu, Katanga, Kasai, Province Oriental and Bandundu have to pay taxes , that the governement comes with a law that protect artists against piracy and that they arrest all those Chinese, Indian and Libanese people who doing it (selling albums everywhere for $1). If that happens they have just to sell 1 million copies (Congo has more than 83 millions inhabitants) to become multi-millionaires. They have not be forced to make 30 songs, live on matolo and mabanga, having to do black business or touring months long in Europe to survive. Also it will allow artists living in Kisangani, Lubumbashi, Goma, Bukavu, Kananga and Matadi to live well without being known in Kinshasa. If this all don't happen then they will have a big problem in the future. Imagine if the concert-ban stays until 2030 or that World War III comes in Europe, bako suka wapi? They have to fix those problem and stop those stupid wars.

Yes Congolese artists need to start fighting for their rights as artists and that includes band members , they can easily become more wealthy by simply getting money from ads,radio,TV etc. Then they wouldn't have to do have to really doing matolo and mabanga. They also have to strike down all videos and music tof them that's not in their page , because that can easily bring in ad money (videos and songs get up to hundred thousands to 2 million views). But music streaming does bring in something extra. Touring for months does help them bring in more fans and take their music across borders, Justin Bieber had a year long tour a couple years ago If I remember correctly.
Or moto asala le monde eza yo Nzambe tata, Kita okata po mokili trop matata, kata- Fally Ipupa