Author Topic: Where did the obsession with doing Plein (full) concerts came from?  (Read 276 times)

congo-243 on: August 11, 2019, 19:36

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For example i don't see it with rap fans being so focused on how many people showed up to concert

mvulusi96 #1 on: August 11, 2019, 19:43

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From the succes of Koffi at Olympia and Zenith de Paris in 1998 and his flop at Stade des Martyrs in 1999, it became worser when JB and Werra performed at Palais du Peuple with from then people starting comparing the crowd of concerts and talking about who did mpiaka and who not. Even people in normal starting doing that, about weddings and parties being mpiaka and also pastors starting to preach at Stade des Martyrs and Palais du Peuple.

« Last Edit: August 11, 2019, 19:45 by mvulusi96 »

congo-243 #2 on: August 11, 2019, 20:00

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From the succes of Koffi at Olympia and Zenith de Paris in 1998 and his flop at Stade des Martyrs in 1999, it became worser when JB and Werra performed at Palais du Peuple with from then people starting comparing the crowd of concerts and talking about who did mpiaka and who not. Even people in normal starting doing that, about weddings and parties being mpiaka and also pastors starting to preach at Stade des Martyrs and Palais du Peuple.
So that's where it stems from. It's annoying like do you appreciate the artist performing or are you just worried about mpiaka or not, the congelese crowd worries about the most stupidest things, I've heard that even Papa Wemba was being laughed at for doing mpiakas like zenith, any truth to that?

mvulusi96 #3 on: August 11, 2019, 20:24

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.

congo-243 #4 on: August 11, 2019, 20:29

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.
I understand now. What was the cause of our music not being at the top anymore in those times, what is that music became mediocre or lack of producers? In my pinion in terms of success our music was at his best around 98/99/00

Matebu #5 on: August 11, 2019, 23:13

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.
I understand now. What was the cause of our music not being at the top anymore in those times, what is that music became mediocre or lack of producers? In my pinion in terms of success our music was at his best around 98/99/00

The Ngulu affair scared a lot of Congolese back in 2003; Wemba was made an example even though other artists were equally as guilty. Also you have to note this was the year Sono (Next) reached bankruptcy, JPS (RIP) started having his legal issues), and Simon SIPE began to decline. Many factors can to a head that year, although some of the pundits like Jimmy Mukelenge, and co predicted it years beforehand.

Although 1998-2001 were the best years, it came at a cost long-term
« Last Edit: August 11, 2019, 23:16 by Matebu »

mvulusi96 #6 on: August 11, 2019, 23:31

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.
I understand now. What was the cause of our music not being at the top anymore in those times, what is that music became mediocre or lack of producers? In my pinion in terms of success our music was at his best around 98/99/00

There are many factors, the ngulu-affaire which made Werrason, Papa Wemba, Nyoka Longo and Bozi Boziana being arrested. Also Congolese people saying that Congolese music started to become monotonous because of most song being focused on animation with bandleaders and singers not more singing alot like in the past (70s and 80s) with them also urguing about the songs not making any sense because of bands only singing names of people and not a proper text, one song being dedicated to 2/3 different donors, etc. Then also alot of donors based in Europe who were making money by shekula (fraud), selling drugs, etc. falling one by one because of European governements becoming stricter while they were financing those bigs fanclubs (Koffi Olomide, Papa Wemba, JB Mpiana, Werrason, etc.) who were mobilizing people for album releases and big events in Paris, London and Brussels. In the same year the Coupe-Decale revolution came. Another problem was that all big fanclubs of Paris were owned by people coming from West-Africa and with the revolution of Coupe Decale they started to boycot Congolese music and/or playing it less in their nightclubs.

I think also that them having already filled Olympia, Zenith and Bercy many slowed the competition down, because there wasn't something special anymore and Congolese artists already achieved their objects of filling those halls which was seen as impossible before 1998. I think that it would have been a different story if Koffi Olomide was allowed to perform at Parc des Princes with JB Mpiana, Werrason and Papa Wemba following to prove that they are bigger/more popular then him. The ban of JB Mpiana coming in Europe/the of JB vs Werra beef in 2002 slowed Congolese music also down. Because their competition was putting some fire. For example the fara-fara of JB Mpiana performing at Zenith de Paris and Werrason at Villejuif, JB Mpiana performing at Bercy to "correct" Werrason's plein (which unfortunately didn't happen). I remember in 2002 when JB was about to return to Kinshasa to plan a Triple Zenith-event for 2003 to counter Werrason's Double Zenith-event.

Koffi once said that Werrason was furious and jealous about JB Mpiana performing at Zenith and Olympia before him, especially the gold record of Feux de l'Amour he received from Simon Ndjonang with Koffi claming him down and Werrason promising to himself that he would prove JB Mpiana. Werrason himself with to claim several times in press conferences that JB Mpiana's gold record was fack.


After the release of Solola Bien Werrason didn't know where to start his next Europe-tour and let his fans at La Zamba Playa vote between Olympia, Zenith and Bercy (where Koffi just performed). With the most fans then voting for Bercy. Werrason was scared to perform there because of its capacity (17.000 seats at that time, before becoming 20.300 in 2012), he postponed his event at Bercy 3 times. But he ended up by peforming at a sold out Bercy and later he would received a sold record for Solola Bien in 2002 at Zenith de Paris. But in 2005, Baby Ndombe claimed that gold record was fake by saying this "C'est sont souvent des causes banales : jalousie, leadership, etc. C'est moi le number one ; c'est moi qui ai fait ceci avant les autres ; c'est moi qui étais avant, etc. Y-a-t-il parmi ces soi-disant leaders un seul qui ait obtenu un vrai disque d'or ? Personne. Qui a vendu plus de 100.000 disques ? Personne. Je vous le dis en vérité. Ce sont souvent des manigances avec des producteurs. Le producteur commande plus de 60.000 disques ; vous vendez 30.000 ou 40.000 disques et vous déclarez que vous avez vendu 60.000 disques ; ce qui est faux. Nous avons procédé de la même façon dans Wenge Musica Maison Mère pour avoir le disque d'or. C'est de la malhonnêteté. Et celle-ci a vraiment élu domicile chez les artistes musiciens."



mvulusi96 #7 on: August 11, 2019, 23:42

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Don't forget that in 2003 there wasn't a band from Kinshasa who came to Europe to tour, except Koffi in December 2003 for his Zenith. Zaiko Langa Langa was stuck in Europe for the ngulu-affaire, Wenge Maison Mere hadn't any project to come that year and had also problems because of the ngulu-affaire which would follow them 2 years long, Papa Wemba wasn't allowed to return back to Kinshasa after his release from prison. The most awaited artist that year was JB Mpiana, for his 1 year long absence, they made huge promotion for his event at Zenith in July 2003 on RFI and Africa N1. But he saw his visa's seeing refused for the fifth time. Adolphe Dominugez made proudly tv-roundups in Kinshasa to say that he will be the first artist to perform in the Schengen-area after the ngulu-affaire, but he saw his 25 visa's being cancelled on the last minute and him being very furious claiming that Koffi was behind all that.

congo-243 #8 on: August 12, 2019, 00:05

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Don't forget that in 2003 there wasn't a band from Kinshasa who came to Europe to tour, except Koffi in December 2003 for his Zenith. Zaiko Langa Langa was stuck in Europe for the ngulu-affaire, Wenge Maison Mere hadn't any project to come that year and had also problems because of the ngulu-affaire which would follow them 2 years long, Papa Wemba wasn't allowed to return back to Kinshasa after his release from prison. The most awaited artist that year was JB Mpiana, for his 1 year long absence, they made huge promotion for his event at Zenith in July 2003 on RFI and Africa N1. But he saw his visa's seeing refused for the fifth time. Adolphe Dominugez made proudly tv-roundups in Kinshasa to say that he will be the first artist to perform in the Schengen-area after the ngulu-affaire, but he saw his 25 visa's being cancelled on the last minute and him being very furious claiming that Koffi was behind all that.
Wow after reading all of this 2003 really was horror year for our music how sad. Is there a possibility to check which artist really went gold? because it would be very shocking to me if nobody managed to get at least a disque d'or

congo-243 #9 on: August 12, 2019, 00:09

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.
I understand now. What was the cause of our music not being at the top anymore in those times, what is that music became mediocre or lack of producers? In my pinion in terms of success our music was at his best around 98/99/00

There are many factors, the ngulu-affaire which made Werrason, Papa Wemba, Nyoka Longo and Bozi Boziana being arrested. Also Congolese people saying that Congolese music started to become monotonous because of most song being focused on animation with bandleaders and singers not more singing alot like in the past (70s and 80s) with them also urguing about the songs not making any sense because of bands only singing names of people and not a proper text, one song being dedicated to 2/3 different donors, etc. Then also alot of donors based in Europe who were making money by shekula (fraud), selling drugs, etc. falling one by one because of European governements becoming stricter while they were financing those bigs fanclubs (Koffi Olomide, Papa Wemba, JB Mpiana, Werrason, etc.) who were mobilizing people for album releases and big events in Paris, London and Brussels. In the same year the Coupe-Decale revolution came. Another problem was that all big fanclubs of Paris were owned by people coming from West-Africa and with the revolution of Coupe Decale they started to boycot Congolese music and/or playing it less in their nightclubs.

I think also that them having already filled Olympia, Zenith and Bercy many slowed the competition down, because there wasn't something special anymore and Congolese artists already achieved their objects of filling those halls which was seen as impossible before 1998. I think that it would have been a different story if Koffi Olomide was allowed to perform at Parc des Princes with JB Mpiana, Werrason and Papa Wemba following to prove that they are bigger/more popular then him. The ban of JB Mpiana coming in Europe/the of JB vs Werra beef in 2002 slowed Congolese music also down. Because their competition was putting some fire. For example the fara-fara of JB Mpiana performing at Zenith de Paris and Werrason at Villejuif, JB Mpiana performing at Bercy to "correct" Werrason's plein (which unfortunately didn't happen). I remember in 2002 when JB was about to return to Kinshasa to plan a Triple Zenith-event for 2003 to counter Werrason's Double Zenith-event.

Koffi once said that Werrason was furious and jealous about JB Mpiana performing at Zenith and Olympia before him, especially the gold record of Feux de l'Amour he received from Simon Ndjonang with Koffi claming him down and Werrason promising to himself that he would prove JB Mpiana. Werrason himself with to claim several times in press conferences that JB Mpiana's gold record was fack.


After the release of Solola Bien Werrason didn't know where to start his next Europe-tour and let his fans at La Zamba Playa vote between Olympia, Zenith and Bercy (where Koffi just performed). With the most fans then voting for Bercy. Werrason was scared to perform there because of its capacity (17.000 seats at that time, before becoming 20.300 in 2012), he postponed his event at Bercy 3 times. But he ended up by peforming at a sold out Bercy and later he would received a sold record for Solola Bien in 2002 at Zenith de Paris. But in 2005, Baby Ndombe claimed that gold record was fake by saying this "C'est sont souvent des causes banales : jalousie, leadership, etc. C'est moi le number one ; c'est moi qui ai fait ceci avant les autres ; c'est moi qui étais avant, etc. Y-a-t-il parmi ces soi-disant leaders un seul qui ait obtenu un vrai disque d'or ? Personne. Qui a vendu plus de 100.000 disques ? Personne. Je vous le dis en vérité. Ce sont souvent des manigances avec des producteurs. Le producteur commande plus de 60.000 disques ; vous vendez 30.000 ou 40.000 disques et vous déclarez que vous avez vendu 60.000 disques ; ce qui est faux. Nous avons procédé de la même façon dans Wenge Musica Maison Mère pour avoir le disque d'or. C'est de la malhonnêteté. Et celle-ci a vraiment élu domicile chez les artistes musiciens."
Why didn't they allow Koffi to perform at Parc de Princes ?

mvulusi96 #10 on: August 12, 2019, 00:20

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nobody did get an official gold record in France certified by SNEP. You have just to check their website. All Congolese people on Facebook were shocked when they discoreved it last year with those internet-journalists making multiple analyse-videos on youtube about it.

The only Congolese artist to receive a gold record was Papa Wemba but that was in the USA for having sold more than 500.000 copies with his album Emotion. It was mostly due to the single Fa Fa Fa Fa and the tour he made with Peter Gabriel.

 Back in 80's Abeti Masikini manager Gerard Akueson made an argement with SACEM for African artist to got gold records in France since that it was very hard for them in that era to get gold records since that they weren't alot of African people in France in that era. So they made a deal with a factory in Germany and SACEM that had only would only sell 100.000 (i forgot how many) exactly to sell around the world instead of only in France. From then Abeti Masikini received a "fack" gold record in 1982 and later Koffi Olomide, JB Mpiana and Werrason, Fally, etc. following.

In Zaire its self from 70s Evoloko Lay (for Mbeya Mbeya, Eluzam and Fievre Mondo) and Lutumba Simaro (for Ebale ya Zaire) were getting gold records from Soneca. Back in those days all people living in Zaire were able to buy a disc until 1975 when the crisis came and the downfall of Soneca. The musiclabels (Parions, Veve, etc.) were making money on their backs because of them not knowing their rights. Artists like Evoloko and Papa Wemba (for the song Amazone) were getting VW Passat cars from their labels (just for closing their eyes) and those bosses getting millions. But in South Africa you got still those music recording certification.


mvulusi96 #11 on: August 12, 2019, 00:22

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.
I understand now. What was the cause of our music not being at the top anymore in those times, what is that music became mediocre or lack of producers? In my pinion in terms of success our music was at his best around 98/99/00

There are many factors, the ngulu-affaire which made Werrason, Papa Wemba, Nyoka Longo and Bozi Boziana being arrested. Also Congolese people saying that Congolese music started to become monotonous because of most song being focused on animation with bandleaders and singers not more singing alot like in the past (70s and 80s) with them also urguing about the songs not making any sense because of bands only singing names of people and not a proper text, one song being dedicated to 2/3 different donors, etc. Then also alot of donors based in Europe who were making money by shekula (fraud), selling drugs, etc. falling one by one because of European governements becoming stricter while they were financing those bigs fanclubs (Koffi Olomide, Papa Wemba, JB Mpiana, Werrason, etc.) who were mobilizing people for album releases and big events in Paris, London and Brussels. In the same year the Coupe-Decale revolution came. Another problem was that all big fanclubs of Paris were owned by people coming from West-Africa and with the revolution of Coupe Decale they started to boycot Congolese music and/or playing it less in their nightclubs.

I think also that them having already filled Olympia, Zenith and Bercy many slowed the competition down, because there wasn't something special anymore and Congolese artists already achieved their objects of filling those halls which was seen as impossible before 1998. I think that it would have been a different story if Koffi Olomide was allowed to perform at Parc des Princes with JB Mpiana, Werrason and Papa Wemba following to prove that they are bigger/more popular then him. The ban of JB Mpiana coming in Europe/the of JB vs Werra beef in 2002 slowed Congolese music also down. Because their competition was putting some fire. For example the fara-fara of JB Mpiana performing at Zenith de Paris and Werrason at Villejuif, JB Mpiana performing at Bercy to "correct" Werrason's plein (which unfortunately didn't happen). I remember in 2002 when JB was about to return to Kinshasa to plan a Triple Zenith-event for 2003 to counter Werrason's Double Zenith-event.

Koffi once said that Werrason was furious and jealous about JB Mpiana performing at Zenith and Olympia before him, especially the gold record of Feux de l'Amour he received from Simon Ndjonang with Koffi claming him down and Werrason promising to himself that he would prove JB Mpiana. Werrason himself with to claim several times in press conferences that JB Mpiana's gold record was fack.


After the release of Solola Bien Werrason didn't know where to start his next Europe-tour and let his fans at La Zamba Playa vote between Olympia, Zenith and Bercy (where Koffi just performed). With the most fans then voting for Bercy. Werrason was scared to perform there because of its capacity (17.000 seats at that time, before becoming 20.300 in 2012), he postponed his event at Bercy 3 times. But he ended up by peforming at a sold out Bercy and later he would received a sold record for Solola Bien in 2002 at Zenith de Paris. But in 2005, Baby Ndombe claimed that gold record was fake by saying this "C'est sont souvent des causes banales : jalousie, leadership, etc. C'est moi le number one ; c'est moi qui ai fait ceci avant les autres ; c'est moi qui étais avant, etc. Y-a-t-il parmi ces soi-disant leaders un seul qui ait obtenu un vrai disque d'or ? Personne. Qui a vendu plus de 100.000 disques ? Personne. Je vous le dis en vérité. Ce sont souvent des manigances avec des producteurs. Le producteur commande plus de 60.000 disques ; vous vendez 30.000 ou 40.000 disques et vous déclarez que vous avez vendu 60.000 disques ; ce qui est faux. Nous avons procédé de la même façon dans Wenge Musica Maison Mère pour avoir le disque d'or. C'est de la malhonnêteté. Et celle-ci a vraiment élu domicile chez les artistes musiciens."
Why didn't they allow Koffi to perform at Parc de Princes ?

Because of them not taking him seriously since that he wasn't signed to a major. He came every year back (2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 & 2004) there to talk with the management to plan a concert, but they kept refusing.

congo-243 #12 on: August 12, 2019, 00:33

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not really. In that era the succes of Congolese music in Europe started to finish. It was was Emeneya who was doing on tv. It was in 2003, when Wemba performed at Zenith after having spended 3 months in jail. But the concert was a big mpiaka because of bad promotion and Congolese music didn't had alot of succes anymore. Koffi would get the same thing at Zenith 2 months later. That stuff about plein made his return in 2010 when Fally and Ferre planned their concert at Zenith.
I understand now. What was the cause of our music not being at the top anymore in those times, what is that music became mediocre or lack of producers? In my pinion in terms of success our music was at his best around 98/99/00

There are many factors, the ngulu-affaire which made Werrason, Papa Wemba, Nyoka Longo and Bozi Boziana being arrested. Also Congolese people saying that Congolese music started to become monotonous because of most song being focused on animation with bandleaders and singers not more singing alot like in the past (70s and 80s) with them also urguing about the songs not making any sense because of bands only singing names of people and not a proper text, one song being dedicated to 2/3 different donors, etc. Then also alot of donors based in Europe who were making money by shekula (fraud), selling drugs, etc. falling one by one because of European governements becoming stricter while they were financing those bigs fanclubs (Koffi Olomide, Papa Wemba, JB Mpiana, Werrason, etc.) who were mobilizing people for album releases and big events in Paris, London and Brussels. In the same year the Coupe-Decale revolution came. Another problem was that all big fanclubs of Paris were owned by people coming from West-Africa and with the revolution of Coupe Decale they started to boycot Congolese music and/or playing it less in their nightclubs.

I think also that them having already filled Olympia, Zenith and Bercy many slowed the competition down, because there wasn't something special anymore and Congolese artists already achieved their objects of filling those halls which was seen as impossible before 1998. I think that it would have been a different story if Koffi Olomide was allowed to perform at Parc des Princes with JB Mpiana, Werrason and Papa Wemba following to prove that they are bigger/more popular then him. The ban of JB Mpiana coming in Europe/the of JB vs Werra beef in 2002 slowed Congolese music also down. Because their competition was putting some fire. For example the fara-fara of JB Mpiana performing at Zenith de Paris and Werrason at Villejuif, JB Mpiana performing at Bercy to "correct" Werrason's plein (which unfortunately didn't happen). I remember in 2002 when JB was about to return to Kinshasa to plan a Triple Zenith-event for 2003 to counter Werrason's Double Zenith-event.

Koffi once said that Werrason was furious and jealous about JB Mpiana performing at Zenith and Olympia before him, especially the gold record of Feux de l'Amour he received from Simon Ndjonang with Koffi claming him down and Werrason promising to himself that he would prove JB Mpiana. Werrason himself with to claim several times in press conferences that JB Mpiana's gold record was fack.


After the release of Solola Bien Werrason didn't know where to start his next Europe-tour and let his fans at La Zamba Playa vote between Olympia, Zenith and Bercy (where Koffi just performed). With the most fans then voting for Bercy. Werrason was scared to perform there because of its capacity (17.000 seats at that time, before becoming 20.300 in 2012), he postponed his event at Bercy 3 times. But he ended up by peforming at a sold out Bercy and later he would received a sold record for Solola Bien in 2002 at Zenith de Paris. But in 2005, Baby Ndombe claimed that gold record was fake by saying this "C'est sont souvent des causes banales : jalousie, leadership, etc. C'est moi le number one ; c'est moi qui ai fait ceci avant les autres ; c'est moi qui étais avant, etc. Y-a-t-il parmi ces soi-disant leaders un seul qui ait obtenu un vrai disque d'or ? Personne. Qui a vendu plus de 100.000 disques ? Personne. Je vous le dis en vérité. Ce sont souvent des manigances avec des producteurs. Le producteur commande plus de 60.000 disques ; vous vendez 30.000 ou 40.000 disques et vous déclarez que vous avez vendu 60.000 disques ; ce qui est faux. Nous avons procédé de la même façon dans Wenge Musica Maison Mère pour avoir le disque d'or. C'est de la malhonnêteté. Et celle-ci a vraiment élu domicile chez les artistes musiciens."
Why didn't they allow Koffi to perform at Parc de Princes ?

Because of them not taking him seriously since that he wasn't signed to a major. He came every year back (2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 & 2004) there to talk with the management to plan a concert, but they kept refusing.
That's petty from them because Koffi was popular as hell in 2001

Wenge1995 #13 on: August 12, 2019, 08:50

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@mvulusi96

That sapeur culture in Europe really ruined our genre. Remember the days of Stervos Niarcos and his clique back in 1980s? They introduced the criminal element into the business of our music.

Those sapeurs were the same group of people who would recieve our musicians in Europe with gifts of expensive clothes and money, but we knew it was either stolen or from fraud. For all his praises, Mr. "Hero dans l'Ombre" was nothing more than a drug dealer and him being one of our biggest patrons was not a good look for our genre. Even Papa Wemba is guilty for not treating his dancers professionally, many of whom were minors.

If we handled our business properly with good contracts and proper salaries, we would rely a lot less on mabangas and elevate our music forward. Because not all money is good money and the combatant situation is a result of decades of bad behavior that sape-culture brought into Europe.