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Messages - faithandwar

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This would have been perfect lol

Also I remember this one when I was a kid

SN, I feel like the masses want really skeletal and simple music lately, I don't think they'll be able to handle our music. Despite the excessive borrowing from what I keep hearing. Sadly the quality of mainstream music is going down across the globe. 

On the real though... he could totally make a band like Funkadelic or Fishbone in the US and it could work. But that's far left from the Congolese audience lol.

Congolese Music / Re: History of our people.
« on: April 07, 2018, 01:24 »
Are there any books/journals that are in English detailing this kind of history? The ones that have been reccomended to me are in French. I don't know a lick of French.

Thanks for the well informed response, I appreciate it. Papa Wemba might have not reached the notoriety of Bob Marley, but he's definitely respected as world class musician. American news outlets covered his death, so he was close. The world was definitely in mourning when we lost him.   

But back to the question on Congolese people wanting to see their music consummated like Hip Hop and Rock, why is it so hard for it to be that way? That's why I don't get how Emotion can be well received as a world album but if Wemba wanted to promote an album like Nouvelle Ecriture to white and black people it would be difficult. Or considered  "low" like that journalist you mentioned said of it. That would be backwards to dilute the music into something else because then it's not really Congolese music anymore, it's just World Music. It kind of defeats the purpose of being widely consummated as a genre.   


Papa Wemba brought our music to Japan (he performed there many times 1986-1993)  and to the white audience. So sad that he didn't continue on that way after Emotion. He could have been a bigger legend than Youssou N'dour. Imagine that Youssou N'Dour said that he wanted to be like Papa Wemba, before he started his international carreer. So sad. All because the people around him who were didn't want to lose him and himself being scared seeing the Congolese music-scène being dominanted by Wenge Musica and Koffi Olomide. With him making an comeback with Foridoles & Pole Position and settling with the Nouvelle Ecriture-album. I remember Francis Kakonde asking him "why coming from a high level of Emotion and sincking very low to Kaokokokorobo" with Wemba feeling uncomfortable.

The phenomenon is interesting in itself, Wemba dealing with World Music v.s deep Congolese music. It's kind of like if a deep R&B musician wanted to go Pop in order to sell more records but then they don't want to abandon their true fan base, so instead they revert back.I think that's what Fally is doing with his upcoming rumba album, but i'm pretty sure he's going to find a way to do both. It's like Papa Wemba's world music/Emotion was made digestible for white ears, which I don't get.... but at the same time I do.   

 I think  you and BrazzaBoy had a discussion awhile ago about Wemba's discography not being strong pre 1994 and that his World Albums were not reaching Kin at the time.

Aside from time format and self sabotage...why can't Congolese musicians do their music at it's purest form without diluting it to please white ears? Kaokokokorobo is a rich song, it's not any lower than any song on Emotion. But also that's my opinion. 

This is my first time hearing about Kanda Bongo, never heard of him.

As far as Awilo, I've always heard "Karolina" but I didn't know who he was until a friend from middle school asked me if I knew him. Despite living here in the US, for me Congolese music was always funneled through France. So that's why I didn't see him as big as Wemba/Koffi/Werra/JB. But also I would always equate the big four as African stars rather than national ones. Especially Wemba and Koffi being more international.   

But also for the Globalization question, what can be said about OK JAZZ, Afrisa International and Zaiko? There's also that documentary coming up....

Be it Conge Brazza or Congo Kinsasha, Congolese music has transcended through many levels and is now part of world music. I remember living in Niamey, Niger in 80-85 and from listening to the international radio station Africa Numero 1, I came to know music from artists like Kanda Bongo Man (JT), Pierre Moutuouari (Missenge) and Zaiko Langa Langa ( Live au Japon), Aurlus Mabele Rosine. The genre generally called soukous then conquered West Africa and eventually most of Africa. By the late 80s, I knew The Papa Wembas and the Koffi Olomides. For Non Congolese folks on this board, I'm sure they can remember probably the same artists as well. But all this is not complete without mentioning Awilo Longomba. He was the true conqueror of the world. People like Ferre and Werrason would not have played in Nigeria if it wasn't for Awilo who brought Congolese music/Soukous to Anglophone Africa.

I'm a bit on the fence about the the bolded statement, but almost every Nigerian I know has that Mondongo album. Those artist's you mentioned like Koffi and Wemba already broke through those Anglophone countries before Awilo didn't they?   


"But a sapeur moves as little as possible, just enough to show off his trousers or his shoes. If your wearing a nice outfit, you obviously don't wan't to break into a sweat."

This quote should be put on a plaque lol, it sums up why 90% Congolese men dance real constricted at parties  ;D

Congolese Music / Re: Did not know this album ever existed
« on: March 31, 2018, 22:28 »
Ironically the songs he selected reflected well each band. With Franco, it was about social consciousness and looking for liberty while with Pepe Felly, he wanted to get a sense of respect from someone for his hard work while with Tabu Ley, it was being a womanizer and bragging about being a ladies man. Unfortunately Franco and Tabu Ley did not participate in these songs.

Is there a reason why? I was looking at the album credits and didn't see their names.

Congolese Music / Re: Best voice of all times
« on: March 26, 2018, 23:22 »
I kinda wish that we had more research on the science of our musicians voices, at a technical and spiritual level. :/

 I don't think you'll get a straight answer BrazzaBoy, considering voices/music is subjective. It's kind of like how people will fight over Whitney vs Mariah in who's the better vocalist even when they take range,timbre,register and resonance in account. Live vs Studio.

So I guess we can just list our favorite vocalists, rather than saying their the best. Personally I look for personality, power and tone.

No Rank

Nathalie Makoma
Ferre Gola
Fally Ipupa   
Alain Mpela
Adjani Sesele (in his prime)
Pepe Kalle
Papa Wemba
Koffi Olomide
King Kester

They were proposed to sign with CBS(now Sony Music), but the leaders refused because they didn't want to get the same money like their employees. Alot of things happended. The employees discovered that the leaders of Zaiko (Nyoka Longo, Zamuangana, Mbuta Matima & Meridjo) were getting their royalties of their songs throught their own musiclabel Prozal. Which made alot of members angry. Mr Ngoss proposed Zaiko to build a quarter for them, because for him the succes they got in Africa was not matching the conditions they were living with everybody agreeing. But Nyoka Longo refused, because he didn't want to be on the same level like the other musicians. Which disappointed the whole band.

Wow, self sabotage + arrogance is a Congolese musician's worse enemy huh?

Congolese Music / Re: Koffi Olomide Facebook Live Show
« on: March 25, 2018, 11:19 »
Uhhhhh, y'all wanna let me know the disdain for Cindy on here lol?

SN:I only know her as a breakout female member in QL from 06-08. Other than that, not much.

Congolese Music / Re: The song Affaire Ngulu was so funny
« on: March 21, 2018, 06:44 »
"azo tuna yo... c'est n'est pas musicien"   :D :D :

Basically, the Ngulu "pig" represented all the people who were listed fake band members to get passage into Europe in exchange for a payout. Stuffing the pig is stuff the band with imposters. Early on it would be just a few people, but as they were getting away with it early on they got real greedy, which raised red flags to EU authorities. They would pay Wemba $3500 fee for entry in Europe via aeroport CDG Roissy & Brussels.

When he got arrested in Feb 2003 we all thought his career was over, as every major media outlet made a report about it. At the moment of arrest he was smuggling 15 people guised as Nouvelle Ecrita members.
After he was released from prison late 2003 and had his Zenith, he was extradited to Beligum after to answer for the same crime. The Ngulu affair scared the sh*t out of every artist to the point they were willing to set aside polemic and show solidarity.
Late 2004 he recieved 30 months suspended sentence with his previous 4 month imprisonment credited, meaning he walked free. He got lucky in the end.

Belgian court said 200 Congolese entered Europe illegally via Wemba, meaning he made something like $700,000 gross profit over many years.
"azo tuna yo... c'est n'est pas musicien"   :D :D :D
Nayebi na ngai français te lol, there's no way I would've picked that up

 I remember hearing about that, I thought that was much later. My dad told me about that sometime in 2006 or so but I didn't know it happened earlier or didn't know they had a name for it.  All I knew was that Wemba went to jail for smuggling people in France and that was it. But "Ba ngulu" I heard a lot in mabokes, muziki (moreso JB) and sketches and stuff.

 Thanks for the info, I appreciate it. :)

Congolese Music / Re: The song Affaire Ngulu was so funny
« on: March 21, 2018, 03:40 »
This is how parodies are supposed to be lmao. He literally got all of them, Koffi, Wemba and Werra especially.

Can someone explain to me what the Ngulu(Pig) Affair was? I remember it being something in the early 2000's dealing with our artists.

We had all of Siatula's VHS tapes, Kombi ewuti poto is a classic!

World Music / Re: Some great songs by D'Angelo
« on: March 20, 2018, 05:09 »
Voodoo is such a great album! It's one of my favorites!

Really Love is a great song too from Black Messiah:

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