This has nothing to do with music. But maybe it does. Just wondering if anybody knows the history of their people. So for bakongos, lubas, lundas, mongos, tetelas; what is the history of those people. Why is it so hard to find that information anywhere. What made me ask is because someone posted a thread about Extra Musica and it was a video of a concert and the person was asking if it was really Extra. Come to find out it was a guy named Pape God. I ended up checking him out and really liking a particular song that was not in Lingala or even Kongo, it turned out it might have been in Mbochi. And it made me wonder, with me being from Brazza and Mbochis being about a 3rd of the population how come dont we know more about their history, where they came from, if they have relations to Nigeria/Cameroon. And I realized there might be other groups other ndekos might be wondering about. So if you know your history, would you be kind enough to ahare it with us. Preferably if you heard it from your village elder 

Its not hard to find information about tribes. You can buy books about those tribues. There are many books written about those tribes. Congolese people themselve are not really intrested in that. Seeing it as "makambu yaba mbokatier", things of village, etc. It's mostly Baluba who really like to know and share the story about their tribe, since they are very proud about it. Don't forget that from 1967 until 1990,brotherhood or those tribal associations were forbidden in Congo, which made people in Congo forget about that and about tribalism. Because back in the days it was difficult to marry someone of another tribe. Alot tribes hated each other. Back in the days you got Lulua vs Baluba. With alot of Baluba being killed in Kananga. This all created by Belgians. Lulua did that since that they found that Baluba's were steeling their land. wWith the Baluba going back to their terrorium. Which made Kalonji proclaim the independence of South Kasai, in order to protect them. The same thing happened in Katanga, when they proclaimed their indepedence. With alot of Baluba being killed (my granddad died because of that) and going back to Kasai. In 1964/65 before Mobutu came on power they made  all those tribes reconcile with eachother. But tribalism and hate came sometimes back. The massacre of Baluba-Kasai in Katanga for example, around 1992-93 created by Mobutu himself to punish Tshisekedi. With Kyungu Wa Kumwanza and Ngunza Karl I Bond motiving people from Katanga to kill their brothers of Kasai. Tribalism came back in Congo when LD Kabila came in power and it became stronger with Joseph Kabila. With people promoting their tribes, etc. and everybody wanting to prove that they are real Congolese, since that they discovered that the elite were infiltrated by people from Rwanda. But about searching where their tribes come from, no. But kids born in Europe start to be intressted about it interested. On Wikipedia you got good information about in Lunda Empire (French), Luba Empire (some wrote the story from the start till the end with the belgians, but it got deleted because of to much hate a tribalism towards Basongye and Shawili speakers) and Kongo Kingdom (best version in English). I had a book called "Les Tribus du Kasai", which explained where Baluba-Kasai, Batetela, Balula, Basongye, Bakuba, Balele,Bangendese, Bankutshu, Baluntu, etc. came from. But my cousin took it 7 years ago, since that he wanted to know if Lulua's are also Baluba's.

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royaume_Lunda
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Kongo
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_Luba
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuba_Kingdom

I know through my dad 90% of basic I formation of Kongo Ki gdom and I write also in Mandombe the Alphabet of David Wabeladio Payi which Kimbanguiste believe that has been sent directly from God, my name also is a pure demonstration of Bakongo knowledge, the sad fact is that most Angolans are proud of being Bakongo like me since I am Angolan but many Congolese Bakongo fake to be mungala/bangala but I never womderstood that, what I am most proud of is that Kongo Kingdom has given name two two state (Congo Brazza and RD Congo Kinshasa) plus Angola's name 'Ngola which literally means catfish, the nice fact is that on wikipedia of pretty almost all European and African languages there are wide information's about Kongo Kingdom so it is even sadder to see how it sadly ended in 1918 with the last king's Kiditu being deposed by the Portuguese after centuries of attacks.
I went on a bit with reflexions but I always get emotional when I speak about Kongo's Kingdom

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I know through my dad 90% of basic I formation of Kongo Ki gdom and I write also in Mandombe the Alphabet of David Wabeladio Payi which Kimbanguiste believe that has been sent directly from God, my name also is a pure demonstration of Bakongo knowledge, the sad fact is that most Angolans are proud of being Bakongo like me since I am Angolan but many Congolese Bakongo fake to be mungala/bangala but I never womderstood that, what I am most proud of is that Kongo Kingdom has given name two two state (Congo Brazza and RD Congo Kinshasa) plus Angola's name 'Ngola which literally means catfish, the nice fact is that on wikipedia of pretty almost all European and African languages there are wide information's about Kongo Kingdom so it is even sadder to see how it sadly ended in 1918 with the last king's Kiditu being deposed by the Portuguese after centuries of attacks.
I went on a bit with reflexions but I always get emotional when I speak about Kongo's Kingdom

That's because of Mobutu who finished them and made Lingala have a big influence in the Bas Congo-province with Kikongo coming more on the background, espcially with the generation born in the '80s. The killing of all their influent leaders Kasa-Vubu, Emmanuel Bamba (who was a influent kimbangist and potenial replacer of Kasa-Vubu. He is one of 4 guys who were the martyrs of the pentecost), Nzeza Landu (founder of Abako), General Massiala (it's being said that Mobutu drunk his blood after those satanic ceremonies. Since that were rumors that Kasa-Vubu left him the Nkodia before his death and that he wanted to prepare a coup d'etat against him), etc. and the campain to denigrate the Bakongo-people, which made them feel inferior to other tribes.

It was a set up of Mobutu to kill the 4 ministers. Mobutu scared to population for live when he killed them. Some say that it was a blood sacrifice other say that he was scared for the 4 ministers, since they were very influent. So he had to iliminate them to scare the other intellectuals. Since that day Congolese people are scared to die for the country. Mobutu build 24 years after that Stade Kamanyola on the place were they were killed, which became Stade des Martyrs in 1997 with the arrival of LD Kabila. Mobutu had done similar things on the place where he build Palais du Peuple.

So many of those public hangings occured in the late 60's, as my elders discribed to me. You could've been minding you day in Kinshasa and stumple upon public hangings on a daily basis. And they would leave body out to rot in the sun for days.

He weakened so many tribes that way, by "cutting the head of the snake" publically, then he and his people stepping in to influence the people. Once that happened en mass, many ancient kingdoms slowly disappeared in the 70's and 80's because their most powerful representatives were dead. It's sad.

That's because of Mobutu who finished them and made Lingala have a big influence in the Bas Congo-province with Kikongo coming more on the background, espcially with the generation born in the '80s. The killing of all their influent leaders Kasa-Vubu, Emmanuel Bamba (who was a influent kimbangist and potenial replacer of Kasa-Vubu. He is one of 4 guys who were the martyrs of the pentecost), Nzeza Landu (founder of Abako), General Massiala (it's being said that Mobutu drunk his blood after those satanic ceremonies. Since that were rumors that Kasa-Vubu left him the Nkodia before his death and that he wanted to prepare a coup d'etat against him), etc. and the campain to denigrate the Bakongo-people, which made them feel inferior to other tribes.

Yes, Sakombi Inongo (RIP), his former head of communications said he witnessed Mobutu drinking his and other influential polticians blood on many occasions to "fortify" his power. The way he described it was of someone who was scarred for life, but was powerless because he could've easily been next.

Can you guys expand on how and why was there an anti bakongo campain and how was the campain spread ? Did Mobutu have a personal vengeta against Kongos or just against any group that wasnt Ngala?


Were the 4 martyrs all Kongo?

Manzambi I 100% feel you on RDC Kongos. I grew up in Paris and never in my life heard a Kinois  Brother claim his Kongo background. To the point I didnt even know there were Kongos in RDC until I started doing research, no joke. I thought it was a minor minor portion of their population that was Bakongo, come to find out at a time they were a 3rd of the population.



I do find it odd that every nation that kongos were in we’re always persecuted, seems like mobutu had it out for us. In Brazzaville Denis Sassou Nguesso been trying to exterminate us for bout 30 years. And I dont know much about Angola, but if Ngola is a kikongo word and kikongo is not even the national language then something is wrong. That is where Mbanza Kongo was located for Gods Sake.

Can you guys expand on how and why was there an anti bakongo campain and how was the campain spread ? Did Mobutu have a personal vengeta against Kongos or just against any group that wasnt Ngala?


Were the 4 martyrs all Kongo?

Manzambi I 100% feel you on RDC Kongos. I grew up in Paris and never in my life heard a Kinois  Brother claim his Kongo background. To the point I didnt even know there were Kongos in RDC until I started doing research, no joke. I thought it was a minor minor portion of their population that was Bakongo, come to find out at a time they were a 3rd of the population.



I do find it odd that every nation that kongos were in we’re always persecuted, seems like mobutu had it out for us. In Brazzaville Denis Sassou Nguesso been trying to exterminate us for bout 30 years. And I dont know much about Angola, but if Ngola is a kikongo word and kikongo is not even the national language then something is wrong. That is where Mbanza Kongo was located for Gods Sake.

In Angola is even worse, Edoardo Does Santos since he is left wing and since in 1975 right after Indepe dece civil war started feared that Bakongo could take the power, so in 1992 since election came and Bakongo voted for UNITA (which is a very right wing party the equivalent of KKK in America maybe even worse) Dos Santos has the great idea to send journalists in Bakongo zones and used dead corpse of babies putting them into the refrigerator calling journalist of MPLA for saying that we Bakongo eat children and basically to justify the kind of extermination of the Bakongo who went after, every Angolan Bakongo remind that 1992 date, a pure genocide but since it is Africa it is not famous like slavery or holocaust. Since then we kinda disappeared from Angolan life, being more active in Congo and locally in north Angola making the best to keep KiKongo alive, the sad fact is that in Angola for being considered a real Angolan you must know Portuguese and speak Portuguese and have a Portuguese name, people would check you strangely now if you have African name,

you see in Angola there are two big way of thinking since the Portuguese came in 1492 along with Columbus in Amerixa the pro Portuguese ones (Creole, Luandans) and Anti-Portoguese (Bakongo, Chokwe, Umbundu, Ovimbundu) Portuguese use to send a lot of Creoles who were slaves in other Portuguese colonies in Angola so they could outscore numerically "Real Angolans" so that they could only speak Portuguese loosing their African language, and if you check Luanda or many other cities who accepted Portuguese colonization Luanda seems like Europe, but check our parts, M'Banxa Congo, Cabinda, Cuilofuta, Uige and so on, dirt, no streets only nature, because Bakongo people never accepted Portuguese invasion in fact they only took Portuguese as their counselors for aiding the kingdom but all the Portuguese were doing was gossiping in the royal house for fueling conflict, in fact many kings and queens has succeeded until 1918 when the Kingdom has officially dead.
Despite everything, the discrimination, the hate from other Angolans and so on, we Bakongo Angolans we are proud of being BaKongo, we feel like we have done a lot for Central Africa and there is no leader, head of state who will tell us that we are bad, that we eat children and so on, kingdom of Kongo has more years then Angolan state, and many writers African and Europeans have dedicated full books to the Kingdom.

The problem with the languages is that there has never been an "Authenticity" campaign for African roots like Mobutu did, Bakongo weren't powerful like Creoles who had money, influence and power directly from the Portuguese, and Creole for definition has no African roots Portuguese Creole, French Creole, English Creole have little to no African words so very little chance to make you feel African.
That absence of "Authenticity" combined with full Portuguese influence in Angola led to Angolan people to identify themselves as Only Angolans if they speak Portuguese, many youngsters mostly Ovimbundu, Kimbundu, Chokwe etc. doesn't even know their own African language, and people don't give African names to their children. Furthermore Portuguese made a law that is still valid to some people to use your father's name as a surname since Portuguese people were only accepting Portuguese names, so that they could erase any African lineage, if that "Authenticity" process would happen today or in the next years, probably Angolan will  go crazy and protest to have Portuguese back.
In fact I have got a Portuguese surname which I hate, I really really hate it, but since I have already have my Italian citizenship I can't change it...
People know that KiKongo, Ovimbundu, Kimbundu, Chokwe, Nyeneka are national languages but they are more concerned to be Portuguese

Can you guys expand on how and why was there an anti bakongo campain and how was the campain spread ? Did Mobutu have a personal vengeta against Kongos or just against any group that wasnt Ngala?


Were the 4 martyrs all Kongo?

Manzambi I 100% feel you on RDC Kongos. I grew up in Paris and never in my life heard a Kinois  Brother claim his Kongo background. To the point I didnt even know there were Kongos in RDC until I started doing research, no joke. I thought it was a minor minor portion of their population that was Bakongo, come to find out at a time they were a 3rd of the population.



I do find it odd that every nation that kongos were in we’re always persecuted, seems like mobutu had it out for us. In Brazzaville Denis Sassou Nguesso been trying to exterminate us for bout 30 years. And I dont know much about Angola, but if Ngola is a kikongo word and kikongo is not even the national language then something is wrong. That is where Mbanza Kongo was located for Gods Sake.

It was just to humilate Bakongo, since they were very influental in Kinshasa and having alot of universities, High School and Boardingschools in the Kongo Central-district. (Back in the day Kinshasa, Kongo-Central and Bandundu were one province until that Mobutu in 1966 cutted in 3) Which recreated some jealousy towards the people from the north, who felt that they were abandonned and the Bakongo's getting everything. Before the independence the Belgians created a rivalery. In order to leave in country in a chaos.



When LD Kabila came on power he did the same thing to the  people from the Equateur-province. But it had not alot of impact, since that he didn't stay long in power. I'm afraid that the next president will do the same thing to Shawili-speakers if Joseph Kabila leave.

No, Mahamaba was from Kivu. Evarist Kimba was from Katanga and Jerome Anany from Equateur.

Can you guys expand on how and why was there an anti bakongo campain and how was the campain spread ? Did Mobutu have a personal vengeta against Kongos or just against any group that wasnt Ngala?


Were the 4 martyrs all Kongo?

Manzambi I 100% feel you on RDC Kongos. I grew up in Paris and never in my life heard a Kinois  Brother claim his Kongo background. To the point I didnt even know there were Kongos in RDC until I started doing research, no joke. I thought it was a minor minor portion of their population that was Bakongo, come to find out at a time they were a 3rd of the population.



I do find it odd that every nation that kongos were in we’re always persecuted, seems like mobutu had it out for us. In Brazzaville Denis Sassou Nguesso been trying to exterminate us for bout 30 years. And I dont know much about Angola, but if Ngola is a kikongo word and kikongo is not even the national language then something is wrong. That is where Mbanza Kongo was located for Gods Sake.

In Angola is even worse, Edoardo Does Santos since he is left wing and since in 1975 right after Indepe dece civil war started feared that Bakongo could take the power, so in 1992 since election came and Bakongo voted for UNITA (which is a very right wing party the equivalent of KKK in America maybe even worse) Dos Santos has the great idea to send journalists in Bakongo zones and used dead corpse of babies putting them into the refrigerator calling journalist of MPLA for saying that we Bakongo eat children and basically to justify the kind of extermination of the Bakongo who went after, every Angolan Bakongo remind that 1992 date, a pure genocide but since it is Africa it is not famous like slavery or holocaust. Since then we kinda disappeared from Angolan life, being more active in Congo and locally in north Angola making the best to keep KiKongo alive, the sad fact is that in Angola for being considered a real Angolan you must know Portuguese and speak Portuguese and have a Portuguese name, people would check you strangely now if you have African name,

you see in Angola there are two big way of thinking since the Portuguese came in 1492 along with Columbus in Amerixa the pro Portuguese ones (Creole, Luandans) and Anti-Portoguese (Bakongo, Chokwe, Umbundu, Ovimbundu) Portuguese use to send a lot of Creoles who were slaves in other Portuguese colonies in Angola so they could outscore numerically "Real Angolans" so that they could only speak Portuguese loosing their African language, and if you check Luanda or many other cities who accepted Portuguese colonization Luanda seems like Europe, but check our parts, M'Banxa Congo, Cabinda, Cuilofuta, Uige and so on, dirt, no streets only nature, because Bakongo people never accepted Portuguese invasion in fact they only took Portuguese as their counselors for aiding the kingdom but all the Portuguese were doing was gossiping in the royal house for fueling conflict, in fact many kings and queens has succeeded until 1918 when the Kingdom has officially dead.
Despite everything, the discrimination, the hate from other Angolans and so on, we Bakongo Angolans we are proud of being BaKongo, we feel like we have done a lot for Central Africa and there is no leader, head of state who will tell us that we are bad, that we eat children and so on, kingdom of Kongo has more years then Angolan state, and many writers African and Europeans have dedicated full books to the Kingdom.

I lost my cousin lost alot of friends in Luanda. Who were all killed in their home. My cousin survived, becuause he went to a party that day. It was in 1992. They were Congolese. My cousin explained that the Mbundu's weren't liking Congolese people and Bakongo  and claimed that were supporting UNITA. So that day they went to kill alot of them in Luanda. When his mother heard it she cried and went to her own to Luanda to get my cousin back to Congo.

Here they explained in Lingala how Holden Roberto failed to get the power in Luanda backin 1975.

http://www.mbokamosika.com/article-les-raisons-de-la-defaite-du-fnla-en-angola-44861311.html

Are there any books/journals that are in English detailing this kind of history? The ones that have been reccomended to me are in French. I don't know a lick of French.

Wow I did not know all of this about Angola. So much history we have to learn about ourselves. If we dont learn from the past we can never move forward. Its really interesting how they divided the Kingdom in 3-4 parts. Cabinda, Congo BR, Congo RDC and Angola. And then in each country they seperated ethnicities, and in my country they brought in foced labor slaves from Ivory Coast, Benin and Ghana (Akan-popo) that were captured during rebellions against colonizers of those countries. And kept those people imprisoned, kept them in secluded villages and made them work the land  and wouldnt let them leave the country. Thats where the Mbochi ethni comes from according to a few sources.. Divise pour mieux regne. We must learn our history, at all costs.

Are there any books/journals that are in English detailing this kind of history? The ones that have been reccomended to me are in French. I don't know a lick of French.

I feel like the best information is in English, because French are biased because they colonized us.
Im not sure where there is any work on it though. Depending where you live there might be a library that has what you are looking for. Like the biggest library of your state/college library.