Ndekos I have something thats been on my mind for a while. Without any objectivity and with just looking at the songs for what they were do you think Wenge Musica 4x4 was overrated in hindsight? Only reason I ask is because from 1990 until 1996 they did a lot of work but to this day those songs dont get played much at parties or get togethers. During that period Pepe Kalle, Papa Wemba, Koffi Olomide, Defao were much less popular but to this day I still hear people play their songs from that era, be it in the car or at a party during the slow jams or even dancing to the sebenes.I think personally Wenge revolutioned the sebene department but as far as the songs themselves I cant think of any song during 1990-96 that I can play at any wedding, am I bugging ndekos? Or do you guys agree in hindsight.
I'm sorry but my comment my upset some people but wenge is a bit overrated every where especially on this forum give wenge too much credit for my liking. Don't get me wrong I'm a fan of wenge but there's just some things I find exaggerated, for example why does it feel like nearly all musicians especially young ones always feel the need to say they were influenced by clan wenge.. but never QL, viva, Victoria... or atalakus always give praise to tutu or bill? Wenge was hot but I find that they sometimes clan wenge get a bit too much credit on some stuff to the point that I fear in 20/30 years from now people might start saying wenge invented Congolese music and so on lol
Wenge brouggt to Congolese music something that Americans call HYPE, simple as that, the only song that can stay in Wenge history well, maybe Nicky d? But for others are good songs with great arrangments, but if we check Werra most of his songs on solo are rewriting of Franco's songs, especially on 7 Jours, JB is basically making the same style.but modernized of Zaiko, and Ferre, Fabregas, and other Wenge alumni are always using songwriter and chasing guys of past era lacking originality, Fally too even though he is not Wenge, Ferre is a new version of Carlito, Fabregas a mixture of Koffi and Mabele Elisi while Heritier still have to find his style, I think that after the Wenge era, especially the BillCeleo duo, musicians just saw music as a quick way to make music without thinking about leaving a legacy or making something historical, guys like Koffi, Papa Wemba, Madilu System, Franco it is rare to see them again in this modern era
Quote from: Manzambi94 on November 28, 2018, 19:21Wenge brouggt to Congolese music something that Americans call HYPE, simple as that, the only song that can stay in Wenge history well, maybe Nicky d? But for others are good songs with great arrangments, but if we check Werra most of his songs on solo are rewriting of Franco's songs, especially on 7 Jours, JB is basically making the same style.but modernized of Zaiko, and Ferre, Fabregas, and other Wenge alumni are always using songwriter and chasing guys of past era lacking originality, Fally too even though he is not Wenge, Ferre is a new version of Carlito, Fabregas a mixture of Koffi and Mabele Elisi while Heritier still have to find his style, I think that after the Wenge era, especially the BillCeleo duo, musicians just saw music as a quick way to make music without thinking about leaving a legacy or making something historical, guys like Koffi, Papa Wemba, Madilu System, Franco it is rare to see them again in this modern eraHahaha that's not true. Wenge 4x4 have many songs who will stay in the history. Mulolo, Kin E Bouge, Voyage, Mon Ami Coboss, Kalayi Boeing, Coco Madimba, Surprise Kapangala, La Verite and Daddet Autant. Legends of the 3th generation all used songswriters. Many songs of King Kester Emeneya came from Kikwit. Papa Wemba is known as an arists who never really wrote a song and he wasn't ashamed about it. The same thing for Grand Kalle who was always using songwriters (one of them was Tabu Ley). Alot songs Tabu Ley recorded in the time when he was a solo artists weren't even his. He was also using songswriters. People started discovering that the artists of Wenge 4x4 when Felix Wazekwa came out with then all ghostwriters also wanting to start a solo-career and succeed like Koffi Olomide (who just started beefing with Papa Wemba from 1993, saying that Wemba has to thank him for his solo-carreer after having written 90% of his songs in the 70s). The first artist to do that was Pascal Poba. If that thing happened in 70s with Tabu Ley and co then it would be a scandal. Reddy Amisi who's seen as the best songwriter ever has songs who were orginally written by Viva-guitarist Ping Pong Tshamala (R.I.P.), Lidjo Kwempa and musicians coming from Kikwit. But he's lucky that people coming from Bandundu have not the same mentality like those of Kinshasa. Reddy Amisi himself gave his elders Koffi Olomide and Papa Wemba some songs who were written by himself.
Quote from: mvulusi96 on November 28, 2018, 19:41Quote from: Manzambi94 on November 28, 2018, 19:21Wenge brouggt to Congolese music something that Americans call HYPE, simple as that, the only song that can stay in Wenge history well, maybe Nicky d? But for others are good songs with great arrangments, but if we check Werra most of his songs on solo are rewriting of Franco's songs, especially on 7 Jours, JB is basically making the same style.but modernized of Zaiko, and Ferre, Fabregas, and other Wenge alumni are always using songwriter and chasing guys of past era lacking originality, Fally too even though he is not Wenge, Ferre is a new version of Carlito, Fabregas a mixture of Koffi and Mabele Elisi while Heritier still have to find his style, I think that after the Wenge era, especially the BillCeleo duo, musicians just saw music as a quick way to make music without thinking about leaving a legacy or making something historical, guys like Koffi, Papa Wemba, Madilu System, Franco it is rare to see them again in this modern eraHahaha that's not true. Wenge 4x4 have many songs who will stay in the history. Mulolo, Kin E Bouge, Voyage, Mon Ami Coboss, Kalayi Boeing, Coco Madimba, Surprise Kapangala, La Verite and Daddet Autant. Legends of the 3th generation all used songswriters. Many songs of King Kester Emeneya came from Kikwit. Papa Wemba is known as an arists who never really wrote a song and he wasn't ashamed about it. The same thing for Grand Kalle who was always using songwriters (one of them was Tabu Ley). Alot songs Tabu Ley recorded in the time when he was a solo artists weren't even his. He was also using songswriters. People started discovering that the artists of Wenge 4x4 when Felix Wazekwa came out with then all ghostwriters also wanting to start a solo-career and succeed like Koffi Olomide (who just started beefing with Papa Wemba from 1993, saying that Wemba has to thank him for his solo-carreer after having written 90% of his songs in the 70s). The first artist to do that was Pascal Poba. If that thing happened in 70s with Tabu Ley and co then it would be a scandal. Reddy Amisi who's seen as the best songwriter ever has songs who were orginally written by Viva-guitarist Ping Pong Tshamala (R.I.P.), Lidjo Kwempa and musicians coming from Kikwit. But he's lucky that people coming from Bandundu have not the same mentality like those of Kinshasa. Reddy Amisi himself gave his elders Koffi Olomide and Papa Wemba some songs who were written by himself.Off topic, Ping Pong passed away since when he was a good rhythm?
Quote from: CM PRINCE on November 28, 2018, 18:52I'm sorry but my comment my upset some people but wenge is a bit overrated every where especially on this forum give wenge too much credit for my liking. Don't get me wrong I'm a fan of wenge but there's just some things I find exaggerated, for example why does it feel like nearly all musicians especially young ones always feel the need to say they were influenced by clan wenge.. but never QL, viva, Victoria... or atalakus always give praise to tutu or bill? Wenge was hot but I find that they sometimes clan wenge get a bit too much credit on some stuff to the point that I fear in 20/30 years from now people might start saying wenge invented Congolese music and so on lolThat's because the musicians of the 5th generation are all born in the 70s so its normal they will credit everything to Wenge 4x4. The same for the guys who were born in 80's who see Werrason and the musicians of Maison Mere as their heros (Ferre, Flamme, Kakol & Bill). The generation who saw Victoria Eleison and Viva La Musica are those who were born in the 60's. All bands of Wenge 4x4's generation used to copy Victoria and Viva and dreaming to be like Papa Wemba or Kester Emeneya. Before Mulolo, Werrason used to copy Emeneya's voice. Those born in 50's see Thu Zahina, Evoloko Lay, Gina Efonge and Tabu Ley as their rolmodels and the most people who are born in the 90s see Fally Ipupa as their hero. Most musicians who ended up in Wenge Maison Mere, Victoria Eleison, Nouvelle Ecriture and Quartier Latin after 1997 used to be Wenge 4x4-fans who had their own streetbands. The leaders of those bands started to copy the Wenge-style instead of continuing with their own music-style, so it's normal that people will then credit everything to Wenge 4x4. the original style of Viva La Musica (1977-1999), so different then that when Alpatchino came. The same with that of Victoria Eleison (1982-1997) before starting Dream Team, Dream Band. that's a big difference if you compare it to Fula Ngenge, St Jean Mbelekete or Mazangi.
When do you think we'll see the next wave of groups independent from Wenge and Koffi (Quartier Latin is technically no more since Danger de Mort)?Unlike previous generations of the Wemba, Kester, and Kalle...you don't see Fally or Ferre really embrassing the youthful artist like their former leaders or older musicians.
Quote from: Wenge1995 on November 29, 2018, 07:55When do you think we'll see the next wave of groups independent from Wenge and Koffi (Quartier Latin is technically no more since Danger de Mort)?Unlike previous generations of the Wemba, Kester, and Kalle...you don't see Fally or Ferre really embrassing the youthful artist like their former leaders or older musicians.At the moment there are no big groups that stand out beside the Wenge Clan, Most of the top musicians today are really solo acts (Ferre/Fally/Heritier) from that generation.There will come a new crop of musicians that will bring something totally new and disrupt the current situation, taking the music to a new level. That will happen, but as of now most of the big acts are from the Clan Wenge, or offshoots of the Wenge style.If you look back, Zaiko brought a new faster style to compete with the slower tempo of TPOK and Tabu Ley which was ruling the 60's and 70's, then the (mostly) solo stars from Zaiko( Papa Wemba, Evoloko, Bozi) went on to form their own groups and for a while there was nothing new. Wenge 4X4 Was a breath of fresh air to disrupt the 4th Generation, and we are now experiencing the plateau. We are almost ripe for a new generation to come and disrupt with innovation to a new level.That is why Congolese music is forever strong, because there is always a new generation ready to innovate and disrupt the older one, regenerating the music and keeping it alive.