me and my mates have been having this debate off late so i thought i could get your opinions
we were saying they are inches away from 50,an age in which every single of the legendary rivalries had at least a stint of reconciliation between the rivals,and we then added that sometimes rivals when they reach a certain age,either try to revive their beef to stay in the game with the new generation or make peace to form a strength to cope with them,and my argument in that sense was that maybe the urban generation has not evolved enough to put fally and ferre under pressure to make the move,if you look at most of the urban generation,they have all hit some sort of limit,which often goes also with their first parental experience which for some changed a lot of things as they wanted to really be involved
just came back from kin and there is some weird atmosphere in our music rumba is faceing less of a fight by urban but at the same time music abroad gets played more to "compensate" and rumba is still then falling a bit behind,its like people want the urban thing to still win over rumba but since its stalling they revert to urban from abroad

Interesting approach

But since you're talking about the genre falling behind, I think the main thing the genre needs is new blood. You need young groups again with musicians in their early 20's.

The problem is the funding. Donors only give money to the established 'old' musicians

Koffi and Papa Wemba reconciled briefly to give us Wake Up because Wenge 4x4 were dominating. Werra and Jb publicly reconciled because Fally, Ferre, Lacoste, Celeo, Mirage and the rest of the 5th generation were coming. At this moment in time no one is coming or dominating for them to reconcile, Fally and Ferre have both been dominating for nearly 20 years which is a crazy run, even a lot of groups don’t have youngsters anymore and the ones that are young are sitting in reserves and waiting for the older musicians to leave or get fired.

Like Paysan said we need new blood and a new group to come out of nowhere, it sucks there isn’t street groups anymore either.

But also the other problem is Werra and Jb somewhat regretted publicly reconciling because it made them go down and guys like Wazekwa told them not to stop their rivalry and other folks like Ferre and the rest of clan Wenge were unhappy when they reconciled. With Jb and Werra and other older musicians sometimes advising Fally and Ferre to continue their rivalry for as long as possible because they might be seen as finished if they reconcile.

do you remember that group during lockdown? no news ever since,either they lost members to big groups or the "threat" was detected and annihilated
new blood is really difficult now especially as we seem to be a people of trend followers,now we are in the era of "extreme" solo artists,a friend who works in the ministry of culture told me there is nearly 500 solo artists registered which is probably by far an all time high
we the same people who want  new blood will be the first to split a band within a year by putting them in a leadership war,yo nde leader and then the solo cycle continues on an on,sad state of affairs for people who love our music beyond the polemic angle of who is the best at this and that

do you remember that group during lockdown? no news ever since,either they lost members to big groups or the "threat" was detected and annihilated
new blood is really difficult now especially as we seem to be a people of trend followers,now we are in the era of "extreme" solo artists,a friend who works in the ministry of culture told me there is nearly 500 solo artists registered which is probably by far an all time high
we the same people who want  new blood will be the first to split a band within a year by putting them in a leadership war,yo nde leader and then the solo cycle continues on an on,sad state of affairs for people who love our music beyond the polemic angle of who is the best at this and that

What was the group's name that was there during lockdown?

The group's name was paradis des stars

do you remember that group during lockdown? no news ever since,either they lost members to big groups or the "threat" was detected and annihilated
new blood is really difficult now especially as we seem to be a people of trend followers,now we are in the era of "extreme" solo artists,a friend who works in the ministry of culture told me there is nearly 500 solo artists registered which is probably by far an all time high
we the same people who want  new blood will be the first to split a band within a year by putting them in a leadership war,yo nde leader and then the solo cycle continues on an on,sad state of affairs for people who love our music beyond the polemic angle of who is the best at this and that

Bro this group had sooo much potential just look at this talent.

Me personally I'd rather a group comes out and split after 5 years and then they form their own groups and give us new stars like Werra did after 4x4 or even Koffi did after Academia was formed.

It is hard to create a band, it is hard to securing contracts if you aren't a big star, plus the testimonies of ex artists on Ado Yuhe also played a factor, nobody wants to do those things just to then get paid if they get paid 100 dollars a month and nobody who is of the same age like to be under the leadership of a person with the same age, it isn't a case that Innoss the most known young Congolese musician started to do music on his own just with the occasional dancers and sometimes not even bringing the band with him, Werra, JB and all those leaders who had people work for glory not asking a dime for tears that era is over, plus who would want to go in a group wait Foe 3 to 4 years to make an album just to make a 30 seconds vocal? Or be an Atalaku do song and dance and then seeing the leader get credited as the creator of the song?

The reason why young people are no longer joining bands isn’t really about the money. It’s simply because the hype of becoming bandmembers in Kinshasa has faded. It’s similar to how, in the 1970s, many youngsters  dreamed of becoming football players for either As Vita or CS Imana,  in the 1980s,  youngsters  wanting to become wrestlers, in the 1990s and early 2000s, many women dreaming to become dancers. In the 2010s, youtube-journalism becoming the new trend and now everyone wants to be a politician or a political analyst.  A large number of young people are unemployed and many of them end up becoming kuluna, turning into crime or prostitution (or just making use of different men/women). The crime rate in Kinshasa has increased significantly, people now sometimes even getting shot in the streets and banks and shops becoming victim of brutal robberies. There are also people coming from countries like Cameroon, who take advantage of the economic  situation by luring young people into casting calls for  porn agencies in Bon Marché or Bandal, where they film pornographic videos.

There was no band in Congo that paid its members $100 dollars a month, except Quartier Latin (back in the days). Quartier Latin were the only ones doing that and during tours in African countries, they even paid their musicians $300. Other bands would sometimes only pay their members once every six months and their bandmembers having to rely on sugarmoms, doing matolo at offices of businesmen and ministers or calling different people in Europe to ask for money.

Thirty years ago, $100 dollars was considered a lot of money in Congo. Unlike Europe, where the cost of living, especially rent and food, is high and salaries are adjusted accordingly, the Congolese economy operates on much lower wages. This means that someone traveling from Europe to Congo with $5000 would have significantly more purchasing power there. The cost of living is much lower in Congo, but salaries remain disproportionately small. As a result, even a relatively modest amount of money from Europe can go a long way in Congo.


Another important thing to note is that many civil servants; policemen, teachers, government workers, often go months without being paid. In many cases, musicians who used to tour in Europe, lived better than them. I even remember Koffi saying it proudly when speaking about Babia and Popolipo, not believing that money was the reason the Academia guys left Quartier Latin, since they are getting paid better than a civil servant in Congo.


The problem with QL members receiving $100 or $300 was that their earnings didn’t match their level of fame nor the pressure they faced from their families. They struggled to feed all the mouths that depended on them, while their responsibilities kept growing over the years. At the same time, they also wanted to enjoy nightlife, going to clubs and bars to confront their rivals. Meanwhile, their bandleader’s fame and financial wealth kept increasing, but their salaries being stuck at $100 or $300

Social media also made networking and matolo a lot easier. If you can establish a decent following, you can probably earn just enough to get by.

That's probably why Prince Babia never quite found an orchestra, but settled for a solo act. In my opinion, he could have went to another dimension had he joined F'Victeam, but who his father is already stirs interest into his music.

Given the combatant situation in Europe, going solo just seems easier because it's divorced from that old system that created a lot of beef with fans that made a lot of personal sacrifices to boost their groups which was never appreciated by the leaders. I don't recall Inoss running into any trouble performing venues in Europe, but Congolese singers from the traditional system have had their shows cancelled

The best example of what you said is petit fally,with next to nothing really serious the little fella has already transformed his life to extent that his mrs has opened a little hospital
this current generation has access to decent money wayyyy quicker than before

The reason why young people are no longer joining bands isn’t really about the money. It’s simply because the hype of becoming bandmembers in Kinshasa has faded. It’s similar to how, in the 1970s, many youngsters  dreamed of becoming football players for either As Vita or CS Imana,  in the 1980s,  youngsters  wanting to become wrestlers, in the 1990s and early 2000s, many women dreaming to become dancers. In the 2010s, youtube-journalism becoming the new trend and now everyone wants to be a politician or a political analyst.  A large number of young people are unemployed and many of them end up becoming kuluna, turning into crime or prostitution (or just making use of different men/women). The crime rate in Kinshasa has increased significantly, people now sometimes even getting shot in the streets and banks and shops becoming victim of brutal robberies. There are also people coming from countries like Cameroon, who take advantage of the economic  situation by luring young people into casting calls for  porn agencies in Bon Marché or Bandal, where they film pornographic videos.

There was no band in Congo that paid its members $100 dollars a month, except Quartier Latin (back in the days). Quartier Latin were the only ones doing that and during tours in African countries, they even paid their musicians $300. Other bands would sometimes only pay their members once every six months and their bandmembers having to rely on sugarmoms, doing matolo at offices of businesmen and ministers or calling different people in Europe to ask for money.

Thirty years ago, $100 dollars was considered a lot of money in Congo. Unlike Europe, where the cost of living, especially rent and food, is high and salaries are adjusted accordingly, the Congolese economy operates on much lower wages. This means that someone traveling from Europe to Congo with $5000 would have significantly more purchasing power there. The cost of living is much lower in Congo, but salaries remain disproportionately small. As a result, even a relatively modest amount of money from Europe can go a long way in Congo.


Another important thing to note is that many civil servants; policemen, teachers, government workers, often go months without being paid. In many cases, musicians who used to tour in Europe, lived better than them. I even remember Koffi saying it proudly when speaking about Babia and Popolipo, not believing that money was the reason the Academia guys left Quartier Latin, since they are getting paid better than a civil servant in Congo.


The problem with QL members receiving $100 or $300 was that their earnings didn’t match their level of fame nor the pressure they faced from their families. They struggled to feed all the mouths that depended on them, while their responsibilities kept growing over the years. At the same time, they also wanted to enjoy nightlife, going to clubs and bars to confront their rivals. Meanwhile, their bandleader’s fame and financial wealth kept increasing, but their salaries being stuck at $100 or $300

I see your point.

But the crime rates was also high in the 70's (with all the mythical yankees whose names remain known till this day), until Mobutu cracked down on it. But the 70's was a flourishing moment for music.

You right that maybe we can't have the same enthusiasm for bands like in the 70/80's, but the fact that there is ZERO known young band in a country of 100 Millions people demonstrate that there is an  issue.

You still have young people who want to make rumba/sebene, but in this day and age it's impossible for young people to make a band. Urban music just requires a computer, rumba you need live instruments.

Congo is a young country, but the biggest leaders in music are in pushing 50's.

We need a Zaiko or a Wenge to (a bunch of young folks) to create a new wave for the genre. Since there are no producers and donors are stuck with the same 4/5 big leaders, it's up to the government to fund the genre, like it was done on other countries.

Since our institutions are ran by clonws, nothing gonna happen on that side.

What happened to Didier Masala? Isn't he running the Fonds de promotion culturel? What is he doing over there? Just getting paid for no reason? 

i also suspect that the solo trend is killing the genre.

You need a band to make proper rumba. That's why a lot of these solo artists are doing some type or urban cooked by the engineer.

To me, I might be wrong, rumba is like jazz, rock or reggae, you need a band. It can't be built on a bunch of solo artists. You need bands to create the sounds, solo artist can then catch on later, like it was in the 80's.

It's crazy there is basically no active heir to Ferre and Fally. If these two guys die today, the genre is basically gone on a mainstream level

i also suspect that the solo trend is killing the genre.

You need a band to make proper rumba. That's why a lot of these solo artists are doing some type or urban cooked by the engineer.

To me, I might be wrong, rumba is like jazz, rock or reggae, you need a band. It can't be built on a bunch of solo artists. You need bands to create the sounds, solo artist can then catch on later, like it was in the 80's.

It's crazy there is basically no active heir to Ferre and Fally. If these two guys die today, the genre is basically gone on a mainstream level

It isn't the going solo, I think it is the fact that with this economy especially in a Country like Congo is next to impossible to make a Rhumba/Ndombolo hand as I have said which person from Congo with all the struggles he lives through would accept a system where he doesn't get paid for years, only can eat through begging people and giving them shootouts and have to fight for 30 seconds on a song on average waiting 5 to 10 years to put his own song onto an album? As you have said if  a person wants to make music he has the computer, he can learn to make beats himself, Yo Pe is a computer made song, same for Olandi and for young people most of young people see Innoss as the guy to be, plus I think the 4 leaders,  JB, Werra, Koffi, and Wazekwa weren't good in economizing the genre.